Episode 13: Developing Diverse Leaders with Kim Bianca Burgess of SEAT

In this episode of Rooted in Impact, host Ashley Gaudiano sits down with to discuss how SEAT is building stronger, more representative nonprofit leadership by preparing residents from Black and Latino communities for board service. Kim shares the importance of diverse voices in decision-making spaces, the impact of board training and leadership development, and how empowering community members to lead can create more equitable and responsive organizations. The conversation highlights the power of representation, civic engagement, and community-driven leadership to strengthen nonprofits and the communities they serve. 

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

Welcome back to Rooted in Impact. I'm your host, Ashley Gadiano, and today I'm joined by Kim Bianca Burgess, founder and leader of SEET, a program of VCL Consulting Groups. SEET is helping change who sits at leadership tables across Connecticut by preparing residents to serve on nonprofit boards, advisory groups, and civic leadership bodies. We'll talk about how SEET is expanding access to governance knowledge, building confidence, and creating a more representative, equitable leadership landscape. So, Kim, thank you for joining me today.

SPEAKER_01 0:31

Thank you for having me, Ashley. I'm really, really excited to spend a few moments with you.

SPEAKER_02 0:36

I am as well. And so, Kim, we'll just jump right in. Why don't we start with what is SEET and maybe what it stands for so people have an idea of where we're starting?

SPEAKER_01 0:47

Sure. So SEET stands for Skill, Educate, Act, and Transform. So basically, we take the skills of the community residents that are already existing, and we educate them in board governance with the hope that they will then take those skills and put them into action, and that action will then transform their community. And so that is seat.

SPEAKER_02 1:17

I love that. And what uh let's talk a little bit about your journey to get to seat, right? That that obviously came from somewhere. So share a little bit about how you landed here.

SPEAKER_01 1:28

Sure. So for me, um, I served on many nonprofit boards and I didn't have any support. I didn't have any formal board training. So it's just kind of fly by the seat of your pants. And then when I had the opportunity to move on to the executive committee, serving first as secretary, then vice president, and then chair, board chair, I thought, hmm, this is really a peculiar place to be in. Uh, first of all, as a double minority of black woman, uh, the majority of my colleagues were, as they are on many boards, white males. And um, it was very challenging. And so once I completed my last tenure, I said, I'm either going to go on a uh corporate board and get paid for my aggravation. Okay. Or I was going to write a program for my community because I did recognize, first of all, the lack of racial diversity and then the lack of community representation. And seeing as though many of these uh many nonprofit organizations that serve programs are for our community. And so it just seemed uh, you know, uh a no-brainer to me to get more community representation on these boards. And so that's how it got started.

SPEAKER_02 2:56

That's how you landed here. And, you know, there are so many kind of board training programs out there, right? Board serve, there's a lot of work. How is SEAT different from those?

SPEAKER_01 3:10

Oh my goodness, that's a great question. I'm so glad you asked because there are so many ways that we are different. And I do, I value those programs that are absolutely out there. But when I look at what SEET offers, first of all, it is um laser focused on community residents who are black and Latino. And um that's significant because when you think about lived experience and using lived experience as a leadership capital, you have to tap in to that group. Where, you know, other training organizations may tap into black and Latinos, but typically they are professionals. So they might be lawyers and doctors and things of that nature. So they still don't bring that leadership, that um community leadership capital to the table. Uh, the other thing that separates us, and and this is huge for me, is the support mechanism that we have in place even after they complete the training. So that was, as I mentioned in the opening, that was one of the things that was very disheartening for me. I didn't have any mentor, any networking group that I can say, hey, this is what's happening on this board and I need help. Or what do I do? Right, or right, or what do I do, or even, you know, share some successes. Like I managed to overcome this. And so one of the components of our program is what we call our skill working session. So the skill working sessions are after they have completed the training, after they've gone through the meet and greet, met their uh potential uh nonprofit board that they will serve on. And this is in place. So every other month it's optional. They don't, they're not required, but every other month they can attend our skill working session. And so basically it's a combination, and I haven't, I didn't really realize how much we were building a network of uh seat alumni. Right now we're almost up to 80 people.

SPEAKER_02 5:19

I was going to ask how many alumni you have.

SPEAKER_01 5:22

Yes, so it's it's roughly about 80 people across uh six cities in the state of Connecticut and also in Philadelphia. And so this is a convening which we usually do uh via Zoom, and they can come and, like I said, share their successes and cry on their shoulder if you do. But the other important component that we offer there is what I call a micro skill. So we'll give them a quick 15-minute skill set that they can use to take back to the boardroom to help them continue on in their work. And one of the one of the things that really did my heart well, um, they sent me a picture. So it was an alumni from Hartford, an alumni from New Haven, an alumni from Norwalk, I want to say. Started. Uh they were meeting totally outside of C. It was, you know, they were doing their own individual work. They performed their own reasons. Yeah. They met at a meeting, and somehow C came up. Oh, wow. And they said, I'm a graduate of C. And they said, I'm a graduate of C. And so they they took a picture, it was wonderful. And so it's also, and this is an unexpected outcome of our program, it's creating a network in different cities so that when we need help in a particular area, we can tap into who lives in that city to help us navigate. Totally unexpected.

SPEAKER_02 6:57

That's amazing, right? That ripple effect and so many more tangible benefits than what you probably could name at the at the beginning of this journey. Absolutely. I love that you frame it as leadership capital, right? The idea that that the knowledge and experience is capital is a different framing than I think you often hear. Can you talk a little bit more about that?

SPEAKER_01 7:25

Yes, yes. Because, you know, when we define leadership, you know, it's really been defined by, you know, the great theorist of, you know, how leadership is supposed to be. And um, leadership is actually, in my opinion, uh how you package your experience to help others advance. Because leadership is all about helping others advance. And so the fact that these community residents have hands-on knowledge of what is occurring in their community, with their neighborhood, with the children, in the school system, in the local churches. Um, if we can teach them how to uh put that together and package that, that comes leadership capital. And as you know, capital is an asset. So when we think about nonprofit boards, they are missing a very important asset as it relates to community development and their understanding of it. They have a, and I love nonprofit organizations, served on many, uh, but they have a macro view of what happens in our communities. And there's no real way to learn it other than to live it. I um cut my teeth on a book by a gentleman, and this was well over 20 years ago, just to show you how impactful his book was um Dr. John M. Perkins. He just recently uh passed not too long ago in his 90s. And his his model was um, in order to serve them, you must live amongst them. That was so powerful because there's some things that you won't ever understand if you're not living in the fabric of that community.

SPEAKER_02 9:20

Right. I mean, so often it's looking at data sets, right, and analyzing data sets or um, you know, the kind of partner nonprofit to nonprofit work, but it is different when it is by them, for them, of them, right? That kind of mentality and being able to bring that in not just as a secondary piece to the conversation and the strategy, but as actually as a voice at the table in the strategy. And that's it.

SPEAKER_01 9:49

Exactly. And I think data is important, but my question is always who are you getting the data from? Right. Right? Because the data could be very biased, and the the data could still be absent of the real truth of what is occurring. So leadership capital from the perspective of community resident, in my opinion, is invaluable. And I think um it would really serve nonprofit organizations to look at that as a way to improve not only their board governance, but improve their programming.

SPEAKER_02 10:30

Yeah, well, that was what I was gonna follow up with is you know, what what shifts when a board does become more representative, right? In theory, I think we can understand the intrinsic value of having somebody with lived experience at the table, but what actually shifts for the board and what shifts for the nonprofit that they are serving as a part of when you bring that right into the board?

SPEAKER_01 10:58

Sure, sure. So, so first of all, um, I think one of the main things that shifts is local advocacy. One of the things I often hear, Ashley, when we are going through our program with our community residents, one portion we have them um looking guide star, well, now candid, looking candid and identify nonprofit organizations in their communities that they think they might want to be a part of. Without fail, every single time we run the cohort, this is what I hear. Wow, I never knew that nonprofit existed. Oh my goodness, I could have sent my son or daughter to that program, or I could have made that available to my mom. So, you know, local advocacy is huge. How can we have programs by nonprofit organizations who serve the community and the community doesn't even know that the the services exist? Right. Um so that that shifts. Another thing that shifts is trust. Is trust. So when I walk into my community and say this is a valuable program, and I believe you want to invest in it, is going to be a very different response than if you walk into my community and say the very same thing. Right. So um that shifts the level of trust that community members have in the organization. Um, I think another thing when you think about what shifts is the ability for the existing nonprofit board members to learn how to engage with people outside of their circle. And here is why I say that. Unfortunately, I have had several conversations and the discussion has been well, I don't know how to talk to them. Well, I'm sorry, who is them? Who is them? Right? Right, and what do you mean you don't know how to to talk to them? Well, you know, I I I'm not sure how I need to engage with them, how you engage with everyone else. So the the presence of uh black and Latino community residents on nonprofit board also helps to unpack this racism, this um an inherent structure, right? Yes, yes. Um, this um lack of diversity uh that exists. And not that, you know, one of us showing up on a board is gonna change the whole world, right? But um, nor nor should it, you know, we should not have that expectation, but it would at least start to open up the conversations, right? So that there can be um unity and just, you know, speak to me like you talk to any other human being, because that's what I am. And it's sad that, you know, we have to have these conversations, but you know, we have these conversations when we're going through our training.

SPEAKER_02 14:24

I bet, right? Because somebody is going to walk into a room, potentially, right? That is either not the most welcoming or sitting around a table with people who uh who make a statement like that silently or think that, right? Of how do I talk to them? And so for somebody to walk into a room, right, you want that kind of exposure and preparation of what that may feel like, right? I mean, that's exactly and it's an ask of of those community members to have to handle that, and that is what we have to grapple with.

SPEAKER_01 14:57

It is, and that is why one of the components that we teach um in actually is in our session five, um, it's called board engagement, right? So how do we respond? Um, and this can this goes across the board in any um professional uh environment. How do you respond when someone uh says something to you that's offensive? Right? We we shouldn't clap back, you know, right? But we should use assertive communication to help them to understand what you said is offensive. Here's the way that I would prefer that you speak to me. And is there any additional clarification that you may need to help our relationship grow and develop? Right. And so, you know, even in addition to teaching the hard skills of governance, we do teach the soft skills, people skills, absolutely, engagement skills, you know, and even emotional intelligence, because on the inside, I can't tell you how many times I've become infuriated by conversations and sometimes by treatment. But I've had to learn not how to suppress, but how to manage my communication so that I am heard and not misunderstood.

SPEAKER_02 16:19

Yeah. Yeah, there's so many layers to this, right? Um, I think even I entered this conversation going, it's a curriculum and there's a module, and you know, you followed this, but there is there are there are so many layers to what you do and what you help prepare people to do. I would imagine that many people that are walking into that space don't necessarily see themselves fitting in a board or even as board material. And and you have to conquer not only that, right? That confidence and leadership development, but also again, as you said, the hard skills of what the heck does a board do and what is a fiduciary responsibility and all of those components.

SPEAKER_01 17:02

And that, you know, ironically, is the easiest part to teach. I bet.

SPEAKER_02 17:07

Because that is much more cut and dry.

SPEAKER_01 17:09

Sure. Absolutely. You know, we give them a glossary, you know, uh when we when we teach those hard skills, for instance, when we talk about financial statements, um, I make it very relevant. And so I said, you know, just imagine when you think about income and you see income on a financial statement. Think about your own personal income.

SPEAKER_02 17:27

Right, right. You want something to be more than your example.

SPEAKER_01 17:30

Yeah, right. So it, you know, they get it. It's just um they haven't been exposed. So exposure creates this fear. And so all I'm doing is exposing them to a new environment, but also, as you mentioned, um giving them the confidence to say, yes, I can. And a lot of times they become uh such at ease by me simply walking in the room.

SPEAKER_02 18:00

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:01

Because they see me and they say, Oh, wow, if she can do it, I can do it. Yep. Right. So a lot of it has to do with, you know, um representation and who's presenting. And it's all of those things. You and you started out the question by what makes our program different than the other programs. It's all of those things. All of them. And then some. Um, we're we're culturally relevant. Yeah. And I think that's the that's the biggest factor that has made our program as successful as it is.

SPEAKER_02 18:40

All right, Kamianka, let's take a quick break. When we return, we'll continue our conversation on rooted in impact.

SPEAKER_00 18:49

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SPEAKER_02 19:53

All right, welcome back. Um, Kimbianki, you have shared so much. Let's um let's see if you have a story that you want to share with listeners about somebody who has, you know, gone through your program and is now in a place of making tremendous impact. I think if you can highlight a story or two, um, that becomes really tangible for people to see the benefit.

SPEAKER_01 20:15

Sure, sure. So actually, I have two somebodies. How about that?

SPEAKER_02 20:18

Somebody that'd be even more than that, but we'll take two for today.

SPEAKER_01 20:22

So um keeping in mind, uh, we are actually approaching our fifth year and we're really excited. Yeah, this is this is our fifth year. And uh part of our model is that once the community resident goes through the training and serves on a board, now they come back as a facilitator. Oh, look at that. So we actually have two board members who are who have graduated our program, our alumni, and now serve as facilitators. And so that's Andrew Beaman, who like he's my poster child. He's not a child, he probably killed me.

SPEAKER_02 21:05

Shout out to Andrew.

SPEAKER_01 21:08

But he facilitates uh two of our sessions, and then Alicia Carpenter Cumming, who is just um phenomenal as it relates to Robert's rules of order and uh board engagement, she facilitates uh one of the sessions as well. And so that brings it full circle, right? And so they they've gone through the program, they now serve on a board, and now they're coming back to share their personal story and education, which again you know supports the question that you asked earlier. How do we build confidence? Right. And so we just keep building it from within.

SPEAKER_02 21:51

You keep building it from within. Well, kudos to Andrew and Alicia for their work. And, you know, as you approach this group of 80 plus people, I would imagine. And you'll start to see more and more people coming into that second phase of leadership within the program itself.

SPEAKER_01 22:08

Yes, absolutely. Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 22:11

Given that this is your fifth year, where do you see seat going, let's say, over the next five years?

SPEAKER_01 22:19

Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_02 22:21

Can you can you imagine over in 2031 at that point? Where's Sit gonna be at that point?

SPEAKER_01 22:28

So there, oh gosh, there's so many things, Ashley. So let me say this CEET is our flagship program, right? And it's under VCL Consulting Group, which is our consulting company. And and so as you know, with any business model, um, when you have a program that sticks, you ride it. Right. CET has stuck and we have written it. Um uh through the five years, I have heard from nonprofit organizations, well, do you train people other than black and Latino community residents? You know, our board wants training and you know, we don't fit that that ethnical or ethnicity uh guideline. Um and so for the first five years, my answer was absolutely positively not. Because they're focused. Right, right, because because I know how large the gap is, and I really wanted to move as fast and as hard as I could to help try to at least make a difference in you know my little box. Um, but the more and more I hear, the more and more I realize that um it's a need and I and I understand how important governance is. And so when we think about what seats gonna look like in the next five years, we've already started creating different little forms of seat. So, for example, we have uh seat essentials, and so seat essentials are for uh well, and let me back up to say the um criteria for participating in our seat program really spans on three things. You're black or Latino and you've never served on a board. Because our goal is first timers. First timers, because we want to increase the pool. So with seat essentials, now we say to nonprofit organizations if you have a black or Latino member on your board who has been there for a year or less, they can go through that training. Okay, okay, so that's that's one avenue.

SPEAKER_02 24:30

Still, still niche and laser in terms in terms of racial diversity.

SPEAKER_01 24:34

Racial, exactly. Yeah, yeah. Because anytime you see seat, we want you to know this is for this population. So then um we also have the seat essentials, and this one actually we're just rolling out that's called nominee board track. So this is for nonprofit organizations that are really, really excited about this new program who have recognized individuals who could potentially be board members. So they may have come through their program and been a success. They may have volunteered um in one of the activities and been a success. And they look at this individual and they say, we would love to have you on a board. We want to get you trained. So the board then nominates that individual to participate in the Seat Essentials nominee track program, which is a five-week program, and the board actually sponsors this individual. So the board is now investing in their education. And when that individual completes that program, they go right to their board.

SPEAKER_02 25:41

And oh, I love that because I think a few years ago I came to you and said, we have this council, and we've got great people on there, and we'd love to train them to get them prepped and ready. And you said, No, I'm here now. So offline, we'll have a follow-up conversation. But how great, right, for a board to be able to recognize people within the community that they have already built, right? Volunteerism, program, whatever it is, and to say, I want right, right, I want them here and they want to be here. Let's get them trained.

SPEAKER_01 26:15

Yes, yes, and that brings a whole nother aspect to the dynamic of the skin in the game that that non-profit is the the fight. Yes, yes, and the recognition. So that also helps with um shifting the culture a bit, because before they may have not even thought about it, right? So yeah, I'm really, really excited about that program.

SPEAKER_02 26:42

That's exciting. So speaking of culture, I'm gonna give you uh another kind of future-facing, um, or maybe it's a look back, depending on how you take it. If you could redesign the nonprofit boardroom from scratch, what would that be?

SPEAKER_01 27:02

Great, another great question, Ashley.

SPEAKER_02 27:05

So um, how do we get to equitable boardrooms? Right? That's really the case.

SPEAKER_01 27:12

Exactly. And so for me, I want to preface this by saying as much as our conversation has focused on um racial diversity, that is because of the the personal um need and affection that I have towards what's happening regarding my community. But I am not uh limited and and um and I do understand that diversity requires skill sets from all walks of life. And so talking about redesigning what a board looks like, um, I would love for for boards to start out with a matrix that helps them really define an equitable board. It tickles me when I see organizations that are focused on youth and their board members are 70 plus. It's like, how can you do that?

SPEAKER_02 28:08

Right, times have changed. Times have changed.

SPEAKER_01 28:13

Surely, surely. Um, so starting out with a matrix that's equitable is how I would begin.

SPEAKER_02 28:23

Yeah, and probably ties into mission and you know, programmatic outcomes, right? To be able to look at things like that. If we're focused on youth or focused on, you know, this population over here, maybe we need to think about right how that board ties in and really connects to that mission beyond simply a philanthropic desire. And I'm not shortchanging or undercut philanthropic desire because that's me.

SPEAKER_01 28:52

Absolutely.

SPEAKER_02 28:53

But maybe there is more to that than than simply looking at one piece of the puzzle. So I love that. I think I guess starting off with a matrix. So maybe that's on suits checklist too down the road.

SPEAKER_01 29:06

And then even I think the other thing that is is very important that I I don't see much in nonprofit boards anymore is um the relationship building component, right? Because think about it, we we only meet maybe um 10 times a year. Usually we're off in the summer and we don't meet around holidays. So in in 10 meetings, how well do you know that individual that you're serving alongside?

SPEAKER_02 29:32

Yeah, and and you know, unfortunately, fortunately, um, so many of those meetings are often Zoom or hybrid, right? Happened as a result of the pandemic, and it's stuck and it gives flexibility, which is so beneficial. But the result is you do lose some of that connection and relationship within a board that helps propel an organization forward too.

SPEAKER_01 29:58

Exactly. So I think I think we have totally well, I will say totally because that's like a big wide word. Um that's very absolute. We have missed opportunities.

SPEAKER_02 30:10

There you go. Well, that means that there are things we can do better and differently, and all it's using to have groups like yours here at the forefront of trying to move the system along and trying to do and look at this differently. So kudos to you for everything that you have done.

SPEAKER_01 30:29

Thank you, thank you. And we appreciate your support as one of our um one of our emeritus sponsors for our first Danbury cohort.

SPEAKER_02 30:40

I know. And what is so great about that is, you know, that was in the first wave of our community catalyst funding. Um, it was the first time we had ever done funding that looked at community building and leadership development and advocacy and civic engagement. Um, and it's been amazing to see what all of the organizations that we funded in that capacity are doing. Um, but we have some really cool success stories, and yours is one of them uh in the Danbury area.

SPEAKER_01 31:11

Well, thank you. Thank you so much. We greatly appreciate that.

SPEAKER_02 31:15

Of course. So we'll wrap up Kimbianka with um kind of my final question when I do these interviews, which is what gives you hope as you watch residents and community members step into positions of power and influence.

SPEAKER_01 31:33

I know this kind of sounds silly, but the fact that they still want to step into it. Yeah, that gives me hope. That's why we work so hard to make sure that they have a good experience with the first nonprofit board so that they don't want to throw in a towel and quit.

SPEAKER_02 31:51

Right. That they want to keep going.

SPEAKER_01 31:53

Right, but that they keep going. So as long as they keep going and keep showing up, we'll be right here.

SPEAKER_02 32:00

Wonderful. Well, thank you so much for joining me. Um, I'm, as I've said numerous times, so grateful for the work that you do to help prepare residents for b board service and really expanding and thinking differently about how nonprofit boards are structured. It is already benefiting the community, but um the the effect of that over time is just going to grow and grow in the nonprofits in the Connecticut area and Philly, but Connecticut area that um you know uh work with you and that take in newly trained seat board members, I think you're gonna see huge successes as a result. So um thank you and really appreciate you joining me today.

SPEAKER_01 32:44

Absolutely my pleasure. Thank you, Austin.

SPEAKER_02 32:47

Thank you. I'm Ashley Gadiano, and this is Rooted in Impact. Thank you for listening. We'll see you next time. At United Way of Coastal and Western Connecticut, we work side by side with our community to address critical needs and advance equitable pathways to well-being and financial security for everyone. Rooted in Impact is a podcast that highlights how we are making a difference in our communities. Thank you so much for listening. If you want to learn more about us, visit UnitedwayCWC.org. And if you're interested in being our podcast sponsor, we'd love to have you. You can find new episodes every other Tuesday wherever you get your podcasts, including Spotify and Apple Podcasts.